Ad Absurdum (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
ad00absurdum) wrote2011-07-13 10:03 pm
ad00absurdum) wrote2011-07-13 10:03 pm
Entry tags:
Decided to start posting here too...
...and begin with Unpopular Opinion Time.
I like Mike Joyce and Andy Rourke and I think they were essential to The Smiths.
And this opinion - which BTW I've held ever since I first heard The Smiths - was prompted by a recent trip down the musical memory lane. For a couple of days now I've been listening to The Smiths' first album and two bootlegs: The Troy Tate Sessions and Asleep (which is a collection of soundchecks from 1985) and, dear Lord, the Joyce/Rourke combo is amazing.
The first thing you hear is that Joyce's drumming is rather unorthodox. This especially can be heard on the Troy Tate recordings and the first album. It's not that he lacks skills, it's just that he didn't know bass drum and bass guitar were supposed to go together. I remember reading an interview with Rourkey once, where he said he actually had to teach Mike that - sort of "when I play this, you play that".* The band collectively even sent him to a teacher at one point, but after a few lessons they decided all that teaching was doing him more harm than good. And to scrap those lessons was their best decision ever. It's wonderful to hear what Joyce could come up with, rules be damned.
Another band that had a drummer who played like that was the Buzzcocks. I seem to remember Joyce saying he was a big fan and learned to play from listening to John Maher (and isn't it beautifully surreal he ended up in a band with another John Maher? :D), so it's natural he wouldn't know how to play "properly" in a band. Cooperating with the bassist? LOL, whuz that?
But that's what made The Smiths unique - right next to Morrissey's voice and lyrics and Marr's guitar, it was the all-over-the-place drumming. The easiest way to tell is listening to any Smiths cover. "What Difference Does It Make?" is a good place to start (the "Hatful of Hollow" version has got some nice tricks) - first original and then comparing it to a cover of your choice. The difference definitely can be heard, unless of course, a drummer chooses to play exactly like Joyce. Although that only happens in cover bands. More's the pity.
And Rourkey - great bassist. I wonder how his career would look like if he got into some funk band. Marr said himself Rourke had an amazing ability to shift into that when they were playing. A great example: "Barbarism Begins at Home" (under the cut to spare your Friend's Page).
Also, listen to the live version of "Rusholme Ruffians" (also under the cut). During gigs they always played the song with the intro from the original "(Marie's the Name) His Latest Flame" by Presley and you can hear how the bass line changes from something completely flat to a leaping and bounding gem. The unmistakable beauty and greatness of The Smiths' bass lines stemmed largely from the fact that Rourke and Marr treated bass guitar as an actual guitar rather than another metronome.
"Barbarism Begins at Home":
"Marie's the Name/Rushole Ruffians":
And while we're at it, listen to a bass cover of "The Headmaster Ritual". This guy uses his fingers to play, unlike Rourke who used plectrum, so the sound is actually softer. Still a beauty, though.
Oh Hell, have another. "This Charming Man" and look at those gymnastics (although that might be because of the different tuning).
The Smiths fans, which are really almost always Morrissey's fans, tend to overlook Joyce's and Rourke's contribution to the group. OK, they do ignore this contribution, solely because of the court trial and what Morrissey says, and it's not only unfair, it's plain stupid. They were talented, full-time members of the group, and maybe there was a better way to go about the money share than a court trial, but I can understand Joyce. And I get why Moz feels so betrayed, but not writing down a proper contract - signed by all four members of the group - wasn't the smartest thing to do.
Though a reunion looks like it's definitely too much to ask now. Oh well...
*Fuuuuu, being a fanfic writer is terrible because I can already see the scene in my head and my fingers itch to write.
I like Mike Joyce and Andy Rourke and I think they were essential to The Smiths.
And this opinion - which BTW I've held ever since I first heard The Smiths - was prompted by a recent trip down the musical memory lane. For a couple of days now I've been listening to The Smiths' first album and two bootlegs: The Troy Tate Sessions and Asleep (which is a collection of soundchecks from 1985) and, dear Lord, the Joyce/Rourke combo is amazing.
The first thing you hear is that Joyce's drumming is rather unorthodox. This especially can be heard on the Troy Tate recordings and the first album. It's not that he lacks skills, it's just that he didn't know bass drum and bass guitar were supposed to go together. I remember reading an interview with Rourkey once, where he said he actually had to teach Mike that - sort of "when I play this, you play that".* The band collectively even sent him to a teacher at one point, but after a few lessons they decided all that teaching was doing him more harm than good. And to scrap those lessons was their best decision ever. It's wonderful to hear what Joyce could come up with, rules be damned.
Another band that had a drummer who played like that was the Buzzcocks. I seem to remember Joyce saying he was a big fan and learned to play from listening to John Maher (and isn't it beautifully surreal he ended up in a band with another John Maher? :D), so it's natural he wouldn't know how to play "properly" in a band. Cooperating with the bassist? LOL, whuz that?
But that's what made The Smiths unique - right next to Morrissey's voice and lyrics and Marr's guitar, it was the all-over-the-place drumming. The easiest way to tell is listening to any Smiths cover. "What Difference Does It Make?" is a good place to start (the "Hatful of Hollow" version has got some nice tricks) - first original and then comparing it to a cover of your choice. The difference definitely can be heard, unless of course, a drummer chooses to play exactly like Joyce. Although that only happens in cover bands. More's the pity.
And Rourkey - great bassist. I wonder how his career would look like if he got into some funk band. Marr said himself Rourke had an amazing ability to shift into that when they were playing. A great example: "Barbarism Begins at Home" (under the cut to spare your Friend's Page).
Also, listen to the live version of "Rusholme Ruffians" (also under the cut). During gigs they always played the song with the intro from the original "(Marie's the Name) His Latest Flame" by Presley and you can hear how the bass line changes from something completely flat to a leaping and bounding gem. The unmistakable beauty and greatness of The Smiths' bass lines stemmed largely from the fact that Rourke and Marr treated bass guitar as an actual guitar rather than another metronome.
"Barbarism Begins at Home":
"Marie's the Name/Rushole Ruffians":
And while we're at it, listen to a bass cover of "The Headmaster Ritual". This guy uses his fingers to play, unlike Rourke who used plectrum, so the sound is actually softer. Still a beauty, though.
Oh Hell, have another. "This Charming Man" and look at those gymnastics (although that might be because of the different tuning).
The Smiths fans, which are really almost always Morrissey's fans, tend to overlook Joyce's and Rourke's contribution to the group. OK, they do ignore this contribution, solely because of the court trial and what Morrissey says, and it's not only unfair, it's plain stupid. They were talented, full-time members of the group, and maybe there was a better way to go about the money share than a court trial, but I can understand Joyce. And I get why Moz feels so betrayed, but not writing down a proper contract - signed by all four members of the group - wasn't the smartest thing to do.
Though a reunion looks like it's definitely too much to ask now. Oh well...
*Fuuuuu, being a fanfic writer is terrible because I can already see the scene in my head and my fingers itch to write.